Today's topic is "What We Want to Tell Ourselves" as in what do you want to tell your younger self about BDSM? What would you tell a new person in BDSM? What would you put in a resource guide for the BDSM lifestyle? This chat will be archived as a Garden chat. Please do not post gifs/pics until they are on topic or music. This is a medium protocol room.
We're going to open our shiny new, medium protocol, weekly discussions with a little bit of a softball, "What We Want to Tell Ourselves." In other words, what do you want to tell your younger self about BDSM? What would you tell a new person in BDSM? What would you put in a resource guide for the BDSM lifestyle? Just a warning, I'm going to do just that with your answers! Join us NOW in the 321sexchat room The Garden. Spread the word!
17/09 8:05
I'm going to kick us off with a little introduction. i'm kissa, i've been in 321 for a long time ... and there is a cat desperate to cuddle me Right Now so i am going to be a tad slow
I own one of the larger BDSM Education sites out there and decided to restart our weekly chats here.
This is a medium protocol room, so please keep ruckus down while discussions are going on
Today, let's just have a discussion and throw some ideas around, please. Lecturing is super boring so let's save it for another day, yes?
kissa
17/09 8:11
So, out of curiosity. and i'd love to hear from everyone, what is BDSM to you?
TheFallen
17/09 8:12
Tying someone up in very compromising and uncomfortable positions for their enjoyment.
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:13
kissa appart from the physical actions.. i would say, respect, honesty, trust
kissa
17/09 8:13
To me, BDSM is a sense of trust in my partner, because we've talked about what's going to happen and there's a path for me
kissa
17/09 8:13
TheFallen that's totes valid. It is that way for a lot of Tops *grins*
kissa
17/09 8:13
Auth0riz3d1 excellent, and we're going to touch on those.
Pep
17/09 8:13
Auth0riz3d1 thanks for three important aspects to the lifestyle. My opinion at least.
TheFallen
17/09 8:14
kissa figured it would be some people get enjoyment out of receiving others giving pleasure.
kissa
17/09 8:15
So, we have typing people up with some ouches, respect, trust, and honesty - is that what BDSM is to all of you? Or is there more?
HellPrincess
17/09 8:15
BDSM is autonomy
HellPrincess
17/09 8:15
It's having the personal agency to decide what is best for me.
kissa
17/09 8:16
TheFallen absolutely, I tend to call that the "verbing of BDSM"
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:16
there is an exchange of power in terms of allowing someone to have a level of consensual control in ways to open up a higher level of intimacy and it's a form of expression of identity.
parr2586
17/09 8:16
To me. BDSM is a relationship where most things are turned up to a ten. Power exchange, control, trust, emotions
Pep
17/09 8:16
To Me BDSM is about respect, consent, communication, responsibility and trust. When I started in the lifestyle there was no internet, everything was slow and only whispered when you knew someone. Different times surely.
Ou812
17/09 8:16
Lifestyle that allows one to freely explore themselves is many aspects that society does not accept
kissa
17/09 8:16
HellPrincess that's a great one - and, i think, the essence of feminism, to me
Draygorean
17/09 8:16
Bdsm is about sharing a power dynamic that allows 2 willing individuals to explore their emotional, physical, spiritual and sensual needs in a trusting and caring partnership..
kissa
17/09 8:16
Summers Kiss beautiful
annabelladonna
17/09 8:16
i mean this might sound weird but for me it's personally regaining control over fear and anxiety but i do not know enough about the community to really claim that i'm apart of it
kissa
17/09 8:17
parr2586 does it always have to be at level 10?
TheFallen
17/09 8:17
kissa that's an easy way to understand the main idea of it
HellPrincess
17/09 8:17
Living by my own code. Not by societal standards that are impersonal. It's the best tool I have found to guide my understanding of relationships, including communication, a sense of identity-
kissa
17/09 8:17
Pep Sir, absolutely
kissa
17/09 8:17
Ou812 Sir, how?
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 8:17
I think my brain frames BDSM like a communication style, making your actions really intentional to communicate something specific about who you are and what you're offering/expecting.
HellPrincess
17/09 8:17
Pep I have a deep respect for those who began their journey before we had all these tools at our disposal
kissa
17/09 8:17
Draygorean got it, great answer
kissa
17/09 8:17
annabelladonna can you explain how?
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:18
I would tell My younget self that BDSM.is not what the world perceives it to be. Its trust, nuturing, teaching, guiding. Its keeping an.open mind and delving into the sexual experience is an experiment of sorts between 2 like minded people.
HellPrincess
17/09 8:18
ArabellaKneesocks the freedom to communicate clearly without fear
kissa
17/09 8:18
TheFallen well done
Pep
17/09 8:18
HellPrincess I don't say how and when lol
parr2586
17/09 8:18
kissa depends on the relationship. Some are always that way, most seem to drift in and out of that level
Pep
17/09 8:19
I talked to a friend just recently about BDSM and he said, it's about dungeons and whips, right? I thought, oh boy...
annabelladonna
17/09 8:19
kissa i'm trying to find the words to do it concisely but something about putting myself in a senario where i give up power makes me feel powerful
kissa
17/09 8:19
Wolfbane1 Sir *smiles* we're opening that part up just now.
TheFallen
17/09 8:19
kissa thank you
Ou812
17/09 8:19
kissa by being a non-judgmental community that encourages one to be themselves and to explore and embrace their desires , needs and wants that are taboo to most
kissa
17/09 8:19
annabelladonna that's totally fair
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:19
kissa nods
HellPrincess
17/09 8:19
Pep I've been opening up to more people about the lifestyle- I forget how basic peoples view of it actually is
annabelladonna
17/09 8:19
Wolfbane1 very well put
kissa
17/09 8:20
These are some great answers and, niftily, you're all right
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:20
annabelladonna thank you
Pep
17/09 8:20
HellPrincess actually it was by accident. He doesn't know what I do when the doors are closed.
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:20
annabelladonna allowing control over you also makes you feel powerfull cause you face some of your fears possibly.. i think I understand what you saying
HellPrincess
17/09 8:20
kissa can we have a rule please, where people ask to pm before they do?- sorry, random
kissa
17/09 8:21
BDSM is what we make of it. For some, it's going to be canes, floggers, and rope. To others, it's a scared space in the heart and mind and to still others, it's what we do on Tuesday
Pep
17/09 8:21
HellPrincess absolutely, sorry about the pm
annabelladonna
17/09 8:21
i'd like to tell my younger self that BDSM is not hollywood tropes and not to trust men who claimed they knew what they were talking about. i'd also like to tell myself finding a good dom is really about finding yourself and being confident in yourself and power to communicate.
Jaxxy
17/09 8:21
I'd tell myself its okay to be little and let my inner child out to play
kissa
17/09 8:21
HellPrincess Absolutely, thank you for bringing that up. Please do remember that we're kind of doing a thing here and not shopping for a rack of lamb or a nice rack.
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:22
kissa BDSM in some casses has a very bad reputation due to the lack of knowledge on what it is about
BBC provider
17/09 8:22
kissa the way you worded that was great message received
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:22
BDSM is an avenue for those that are adventurous. In this platform,.words are piw
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:22
Power
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:23
BDSM recently has opened up an expression of identity for me, i've always been a giver, but more than just being sexually available, it's allowing myself to fully love, serve, and care. When a partner hurts, i feel it deeply and my level of empathy is a vulnerable aspect of who i am that i do not give freely. For me BDSM allows an expression of that identity and part of who i am.
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:23
Truthfully I would tell myself that my past "religious" upbringing was not going to define me all my life and to explore more about sexuality and Kink. And to definitely NOT be ashamed of myself
kissa
17/09 8:23
So, we touched on a lot of keywords and i'd like to delve into a few of them to find out your thoughts and what you consider important
Pep
17/09 8:23
Rev_Kinky well put, thanks for sharing
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:24
Pep thank you and I am definitely not knocking anyone that may be religious. Just wanted to clarify that
HellPrincess
17/09 8:24
kissa I live and breathe BDSM now. And it almost never involves a flog. For me it's in the mind. The mental clarity I have acquired enables me to be proactive in my journey- self reflection, honesty with myself and others. What do I Need, what do I want- respect first and foremost. And gosh, self acceptance, like Jaxxy said. Granting myself the freedom to be a sadist, a masochist, a kinkster, to be queer, to be a little. In BDSM I found me
kissa
17/09 8:24
Now, we've all seen people come in asking "What is BDSM" i'd like to create a beginners guide with your thoughts, because you know best, what it is and what's important to know.
Pep
17/09 8:25
Rev_Kinky I was raised kinda religious Myself, don't worry.
kissa
17/09 8:25
Summers Kiss that's beautiful
kissa
17/09 8:26
Rev_Kinky there are a LOT of people that have a very close connection with BDSM and the holy facing life
kissa
17/09 8:26
HellPrincess that's just wonderful!
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:26
Rev_Kinky I think religion stimatizes O/our views on sex as sinful, perverted. Its the exact opposite, its beautiful, loving, and caring.
Ou812
17/09 8:26
Beautiful expression of each ty for sharing
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:26
kissa the number one thing I would tell anyone interested is to ask questions. No one knows everything.
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:27
Wolfbane1 oh I absolutely agree with that. It took me a long time to come to grips with it
Pep
17/09 8:27
I think not only in BDSM it's important to actually care about someone, like literally care through the whole way and not run away when it starts to run or you don't like Mondays.
kissa
17/09 8:27
So, as Wolfbane started us off with, what would you tell someone new to the lifestyle? What should they know Right Now when it comes to, say, TRUST?
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:27
Rev_Kinky Me as well...
kissa
17/09 8:27
Rev_Kinky that's a HUGE point to make. Ask questions!
TheFallen
17/09 8:28
How does one become a Dom then
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:28
kissa it takes time....be patient
kissa
17/09 8:28
TheFallen we'll talk about that!
Pep
17/09 8:28
TheFallen oof, that's a whole topic for another hour!
Ou812
17/09 8:28
For beginning i would /do advise take their time , discuss and explore what speaks to them personally not a race it a journey
HellPrincess
17/09 8:28
kissa BDSM is about responsibility. Accountability. Mindfulness. Intention. Learning. Patience. And god. SAFETY first
annabelladonna
17/09 8:28
i'd say don't attempt pe expect to bein or find a trustworthy partner if you can't trust yourself to communicate
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 8:28
Don't fall into echo chambers. Let conflicting ideas spend time together in your mind and think critically about it.
kissa
17/09 8:28
Wolfbane1 you're right. Why though?
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:29
1st find yourself and what you want from it. As HellPrincess said. If you dont know your own limits and what you want. The experience will be bad and xould ruin something good
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:29
kissa really understand what it means to vet and allow yourself grace and patience. align the emotions, heart, and mind, do a bit of self-exploration.
kissa
17/09 8:29
Ou812 that's beautiful, Sir, what's the difference to you?
Draygorean
17/09 8:29
Being authentic with your needs and desires allows the shackles to come off.. and then be willingly applied.. within a caring, trusting and respectful relationship..
kissa
17/09 8:29
HellPrincess you are so right.
kissa
17/09 8:30
Summers Kiss how to do that, though?
HellPrincess
17/09 8:30
Auth0riz3d1 I find a lot of people come in here having no clue as to what they want. And that's ok. But don't rush into anything. Do not submit to the first person who shows interest in you.
BBC provider
17/09 8:30
This is really informative
kissa
17/09 8:30
TheFallen how to be a Dominant is a huge one and we'll hit that on another class, okay?
Ou812
17/09 8:30
kissa not a momentarily escape or pleasure it life long journey of discovery if myself
Dude4Babe
17/09 8:30
to find strength in my weakness
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:30
kissa building a solid foundation in a BDSM relationship takes time, effort and a willingness of both to ve totally honest with each other.
Pep
17/09 8:30
HellPrincess maybe the second one?
HellPrincess
17/09 8:30
Ou812 this^
kissa
17/09 8:31
Draygorean you make a great point. How do you get there, though?
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:31
HellPrincess exactly.. and most Doms/me might not see that in the beginning. They just go out full blast..
kissa
17/09 8:31
BBC provider yayaya!!!
Pix
17/09 8:31
Trust applies to the O/one before it applies to partners. To O/oneself, because communication is so vital Someone is trusting Y/you with their mind/body or you are asking S/someone to take control of it for Y/you. They must know what Y/you limits actually are not what Y/you think they should be. Trust Y/your own instinct and voice because otherwise Y/you consent could be violated or Y/you could be in a position of having taken someone too far without knowing it. Trusting Y/yourself, first projec
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:31
kissa journaling, visiting with others, and writing down what you need, because for me, meaningful connection is essential, but if i'm looking for soomeone to play/explore with, those are two different needs for me so knowing that guides me in going forward about what kind of connection i'm seeking. Journaling and therapy help a lot for me
kissa
17/09 8:32
Ou812 Sir, but it is for some. That's the verbing of it, right? In clubs with more casual play
kissa
17/09 8:32
Wolfbane1 being totally honest is soooo hard
HellPrincess
17/09 8:32
The best tool to explore BDSM is community
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:32
Pix very nice.. and true
kissa
17/09 8:32
Dude4Babe welcome to the Garden, how so?
Pep
17/09 8:32
HellPrincess I agree
Draygorean
17/09 8:32
To get there you need to be vulnerable... and allow another to step inside your soul... that is the challenge.. and it can be a painful lesson as one embarks on the journey..
kissa
17/09 8:33
Pix that's amazing. How do you learn to trust yourself though?
Ou812
17/09 8:33
kissa for each to discover, for me it a journey
kissa
17/09 8:33
HellPrincess it's sure one of them!
kissa
17/09 8:33
Draygorean that can be super hard, though, how do you get there?
HellPrincess
17/09 8:33
Draygorean BDSM is a call to find healing
JoeK
17/09 8:33
The gardener is here, hello everyone
Ou812
17/09 8:34
HellPrincess supportive , accepting community
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:34
kissa comminication, and to be brutally honest with yourself
kissa
17/09 8:34
Ou812 thank you so much for that phrase, "for you" it's key here because it means different things for different people. We have to talk about it, though, right? Find those common definitions so trust can be built around them
kissa
17/09 8:34
Auth0riz3d1 that's tough, man
annabelladonna
17/09 8:34
learning to trust yourself comes with not letting yourself down and speaking up for yourself when you are uncomfortable i think
HellPrincess
17/09 8:34
Ou812 diverse yet focused.
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:35
kissa in a venue like 321 it is very hard. People need to focus on the fact there are real people you are baring your soul to. Words as I said earlier are power here. They have the ability to express O/our thoughts and desires...they can also destroy someone as well.
TheFallen
17/09 8:35
I got called being a fake Dom and to agree with HellPrincess I didn't know what I wanted and I kinda still don't know.
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:35
kissa it is tough yes
kissa
17/09 8:36
So, a lot of you mentioned ways to build trust, and why it's important. There are other important things, too, right? What would you tell someone new to BDSM (or even your younger self) about COMMUNICATION?
kissa
17/09 8:36
Wolfbane1 that's right and it's just vital for people to remember that theres another soul on the other end
Pep
17/09 8:36
Trust in BDSM iscvital but it's the hardest part. I'm sure E/everyone has made unpleasant experiences with people here who have obviously no idea what trust actually means or respect. It leads U/us to the next lockdown of O/our heart and it's really difficult to get out of that again.
TheFallen
17/09 8:36
Communication is key
Draygorean
17/09 8:36
HellPrincess BDSM is a call to find your true nature and to live in that truth ... it starts with exploring deeper feelings and needs.. finding others who share similar values and desires.. and especially knowing when abuse is on the horizon and a misuse of the power dynamic.. from either side..
kissa
17/09 8:36
TheFallen that's so rude.
Ou812
17/09 8:37
kissa very much so as each needs to understand verbiage with a common definition
Pix
17/09 8:37
kissa that project is ongoing but starting with being honest with Y/yourself about what Y/you'd like to experience, be it actions, emotions, sensations as other have said, write, read, ask Y/yourself questions and really just answer truthfully. The biggest enemy here can be what Yl6/you think is expected of Y/you imho. This is great as it shows that there are so many ways to 'do' BDSM it can't be for another it needs to be meeting Y/your physical/emotional needs. Even if that's a one off scene.
HellPrincess
17/09 8:37
TheFallen I think it helps if people make a distinction/ there are those who know they are Dominant, and there are those who are active Doms. Some look for experienced Doms, not just dominants. Terms like fake and real though are useless and offensive, they diminish our confidence and journey.
Wicked Bitch
17/09 8:38
I would tell my younger self that being submissive doesn't mean I have to accept mistreatment. Because I have the power to choose who I submit to
kissa
17/09 8:38
Ou812 how to you get there? There are sure days when my beloved and sexy Owner and i are staring at the other, wondering if we are even speaking the same language (we aren't, btw)
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:38
TheFallen I think "being a Dom" is a very fluid learning experience. Communication here is O/our avenue into someones heart.As Pix said...first you gotta trust yourself....and your ability to decipher truth from bullshit.
HellPrincess
17/09 8:38
Wicked Bitch yes yes yes.
Pep
17/09 8:38
Wicked Bitch well put
annabelladonna
17/09 8:38
Wicked Bitch yess this is very important
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:38
Learn to speak to what bothers you, do not let unspoken thoughts fester. Learn about healthy communication styles and practice them. Remember that many are not mind readers and a lot of work is unpacking childhood and family learned communication styles and modifying them. Ego, jealousy, and insecurity can rear their heads and it's important to know how to speak to them and not just react from them without pause.
BBC provider
17/09 8:38
I'm still new to a lot of the concepts kinda got more into this viad the Studio. So yes this is really showing me a lot of good information. I feel like I'm still a bit on the outside tho I dabble a bit I'm learning more via all the experiences
Ou812
17/09 8:38
kissa struggle for us all at time , i wish i new , communication with ones own definition has help me
kissa
17/09 8:39
Pix that is an important idea there, that this walk has to be for yourself
Male pet
17/09 8:39
Communication has to be consistent, transparent, honest and all parties must listen to each other and take on board what each other is saying, ask questions of each other and express themselves unequivocally, without healthy communication it's a landmine and you're blindfolded
TheFallen
17/09 8:39
Wolfbane1 that's something I gotta work on.
kissa
17/09 8:39
Wicked Bitch YES!
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:39
A huge way to improve your own thinking and communication skills is using workbooks, journaling, and cognitive behavioral therapy skills, and exploring personal cognitive distortions
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:39
Strong communication is humility and empathy in practice.
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:39
The biggest downfall is the fear of not being accepted with what you want by your partner or "comunity".
kissa
17/09 8:39
Summers Kiss i would like everyone to take a second and read what you said. It's so important, in my mind
HellPrincess
17/09 8:39
Summers Kiss do not let your trauma dictate how you perceive each other's actions and words. Make no assumptions. Be clear, be honest. Respect each other's history and take the time to listen, understand.
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:40
TheFallen learning is dynamic, never stagnent. You evolve into a Dom...through your experiences.
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:40
HellPrincess exactly
kissa
17/09 8:40
BBC provider experience is an important teacher
TheFallen
17/09 8:40
Wolfbane1 that's a good way of thinking
Draygorean
17/09 8:40
Initially my younger self thought that it was about a one-sided expression of my Dominance over another.. without appreciating that it was a willing and shared dynamic
annabelladonna
17/09 8:40
HellPrincess so eloquently put
Ou812
17/09 8:41
HellPrincess * smiles* being mindful of the other goes along way
HellPrincess
17/09 8:41
Male pet nobody should expect what hey haven't clearly asked for.
BBC provider
17/09 8:41
kissa indeed. I have learned a lot over the last few weeks
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:41
TheFallen the type of Dom you evolve into is Your choice.
BBC provider
17/09 8:41
HellPrincess you're a natural poet thanks for staying it that way
Male pet
17/09 8:41
HellPrincess indeed they should not
kissa
17/09 8:42
Male pet you hit the nail on the head. Your answer is epic.
kissa
17/09 8:42
Draygorean yikes, yeah, that's a big one
HellPrincess
17/09 8:42
Don't expect your sparks to carry your Dynamic.... chemistry is only the beginning
TheFallen
17/09 8:43
Wolfbane1 there are different types
Male pet
17/09 8:43
kissa thank you kindly, some really insightful and wise answers from all topics raised here
annabelladonna
17/09 8:43
so glad i found this room usually 321 leaves me feeling drained and kind of lonely this was such a great conversation and atmosphere thanks y'all i needed this kind of positivity
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:43
TheFallen yes...I would say so...
kissa
17/09 8:43
I saw this word come up in a lot of your answers - RESPECT. What would you talk to someone new to BDSM or even say to your younger self?
TheFallen
17/09 8:44
Wolfbane1 thanks I'll keep that in mind on my journey
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:44
annabelladonna i agree %
HellPrincess
17/09 8:44
kissa pardon, I don't understand the question
kissa
17/09 8:44
Pix it's important, i think
Male pet
17/09 8:44
HellPrincess absolutely...doesn't matter how bright that spark is at the beginning, without nurturing and maintaining a dynamic with consistent engagement from all parties then invariably it won't work
BBC provider
17/09 8:44
Pix kissa agreed
kissa
17/09 8:45
HellPrincess thank you for saying that (and being so lovely about asking for clarification)
annabelladonna
17/09 8:45
i would say be very careful of people who claim to respect you because gaslighting happens pretty often
ArtofSubmissionn
17/09 8:45
Male pet that's so true!!
Jaxxy
17/09 8:45
Don't be afraid to find a kink/bdsm knowledgeable therapist
Wicked Bitch
17/09 8:45
In my early days some doms didn't understand that submissive doesn't equal disrespect. Respect is acknowledging each other choices and desires
kissa
17/09 8:45
Respect is talked about a lot in BDSM and D/s circles, essays and conversations. Why do you think it's important to keep bringing that word up?
TheFallen
17/09 8:45
I only asked because I needed help to become one.
ArtofSubmissionn
17/09 8:45
This room in its whole is a big reality check!
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:45
kissa breakdown what respect means to you in action, both in giving and accepting respect. I think one thing i've run across here is so many speak of respect but cross cultural and language differences, beliefs, etc. can really modify what respect can mean to each person. Learn to know how to talk with *most* people when offenses occur without assumption first.
kissa
17/09 8:46
Jaxxy beautifully said
annabelladonna
17/09 8:46
Jaxxy omg that's a thing therapist specifically who work in kink/BDSM??
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:46
kissa BDSM is about inclusion. W/we all have different thoughts and kink. Respect is taking the time to understand that and apply it in.the everyday aspect of BDSM.
Dionigi
17/09 8:46
annabelladonna if someone is gaslighting you, do they really have your best interests in mind, or are they being rude and selfish?
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:46
Summers Kiss you took the word right out of my mouth
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:46
Explore self-respect, what kind of behavior and love would someone who loves you most unconditionally say you deserve, because how hard we can be on ourselves sometimes we think we can deserve less
HellPrincess
17/09 8:46
Male pet I see this all the time the lust and excitement blinds people- do you even have matching communication styles? Goals? Can you provide the other one with what they need? Are you capable of accepting them as they are? Do you both even want to be exclusive? What are your expectations in six months, a year?
annabelladonna
17/09 8:47
Dionigi gaslighting is about trying to mask true intentions right? tryi bc to convince a person they are being respected when they are not
kissa
17/09 8:48
Summers Kiss what you said up there is important about other people having different backgrounds and definitions of respect. How would go about learning to be more respectful in other cultures and even countries?
Jaxxy
17/09 8:48
Research
kissa
17/09 8:48
Wolfbane1 is it?How so?
Jaxxy
17/09 8:48
Don't assume
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 8:48
Respect is far more than honorifics or protocol. Respect is an honor when given and comes in many forms, not just an s to a D, but its how we behave and how we treat others
Pep
17/09 8:48
LadyFlirtatious absolutely
kissa
17/09 8:48
Jaxxy how?
kissa
17/09 8:49
LadyFlirtatious Thank you!!!!!
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:49
Respect is paramount. Especially respect for yourself. Dominant or submissive. Without respect the chances of hurting someone increases exponentially
Ou812
17/09 8:49
Each should Respect that we are not all the same and each choices for themselves which should be accepted as personal choice no right or wrong in preference and that should be accepted
Brett
17/09 8:49
What i would tell my younger self is to take your time...learn and get to know others and don't fret over the mistakes you make...consider that as a learning experience not a failure
kissa
17/09 8:49
Rev_Kinky how?
HellPrincess
17/09 8:49
kissa of course, clarity first and always. RESPECT is the foundation of how we communicate. Am I speaking to just hear myself or am I trying to connect with another human? Is understanding my goal or do I want to fight? Can I be objective about the topic at hand or will o let emotions overtake me, making me self centered and abandoning my compassion? Lack of respect ruins our chances to make progress
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:49
kissa honestly asking a lot of questions, and one of the greatest things i learned as a counselor is "what does XYZ mean to you" and then expanding up on that. There was a situation where in my cultural language, we don't have a word for please so commands are very blunt like "get up/wake up" and in english it looks disrespectful and so sometimes those assumptions have to be challenged and explored from both sides.
Jaxxy
17/09 8:49
Google is free research that culture and find out about whats respectful and whats not
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:49
it takes a lot of cultural humility
Pep
17/09 8:49
Brett ahh well put, I like the last bit
annabelladonna
17/09 8:49
i think respect is about listening to the other persons needs (doesn't mean you have to personally furfill them but simply listening and acknowledging)
Male pet
17/09 8:49
Respect is often misconstrued...there's alarming amount of "Dom/mes" who believe it's their god given right to be respected by others without them actually displaying they're a decent human being, people also deserve the right to respect themselves enough to know their worth, this is something that is constantly developing as we navigate through the lifestyle or life in general but I've found that the energy you give out has a way of coming right back at you so treat everyone the way you'd like
kissa
17/09 8:49
Ou812 that's important to always have at the back of your brain, isn't it?
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:49
HellPrincess exactly - intention is everything
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:50
Male pet yes
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 8:50
Agree Malepet
Male pet
17/09 8:50
To be treated unless you feel you've enough reason otherwise
Wicked Bitch
17/09 8:50
Summers Kiss thanks for share about cross cultural communication
Pep
17/09 8:50
Male pet yes!
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:50
kissa if a Dominant doesn't respect a submissive, then mental damage is possible. If a submissive doesn't respect themselves, they open the door for predatory "D types".
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:50
Wicked Bitch born from real life situations tbh in my own vetting experience.
Draygorean
17/09 8:50
Unfortunately active listening to another is a dying art... being present with another is a skill that requires attentiveness and consistency.. learning to give space in a caring way... allows respect to flow in a mutual way.. by acknowledging through action how well you have listened and how thoughtful about another's needs and desires you have been.. the response should be abusive
Brett
17/09 8:50
Pep lol and i do have a long list of learning experiences
kissa
17/09 8:50
HellPrincess is it always about communication or are there other things it covers, like property or feelings?
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:50
Male pet well said
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 8:51
And respect for the lifestyle is also shown thru integrity, honesty, kindness, acceptance and many other ways
Pep
17/09 8:51
Brett ugh... tell me about it
Wicked Bitch
17/09 8:51
Summers Kiss experienced that too
annabelladonna
17/09 8:52
Draygorean i still struggle with active listening but it is truly the first step to communication
Ou812
17/09 8:52
LadyFlirtatious well said
kissa
17/09 8:52
Summers Kiss that's a big question there - "What does xyz mean to you" so you can delve into the heart and mind, rather than assuming or using social media sticker language
Draygorean
17/09 8:52
The response should NOT be abusive
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:52
kissa by listening and not rendering judgement. Being educated as to why people have different cravings and desires. Mostly I equate BDSM with love. The connection you make with a Dom/sub might be something you never knew existed inside you. Respect others views, you might disagree but respect their opinion.
kissa
17/09 8:52
Draygorean how can we learn about active listening/
Summers Kiss
17/09 8:52
kissa exactly.
Male pet
17/09 8:52
HellPrincess oh absolutely...too often there are people head diving into being "owned" after a grand total of 1 week which terrifies me, how can you expect to earn one's submission when you don't have the slightest clue what makes them tick?...slow down, trust and enjoy the process because it's a beautiful process
kissa
17/09 8:52
Rev_Kinky bless but that's true
Pep
17/09 8:53
Communication can be very challenging, English is not My first language and sometimes it leads to a... ermmm .. puzzling situation.. lol
Male pet
17/09 8:53
Summers Kiss Pep Ou812 Rev_Kinky
HellPrincess
17/09 8:53
kissa oh right right! Yeah. Be considerate of the fact that people deserve to be acknowledge with a basic level of dignity. I AM GOING TO CAPITALIZE THIS BECAUSE IT FEELS IMPORTANT- SUBMISSIVES ARE NOT INFERIOR. Do nottttttt do notttttt dehumanize anyone without their consent.
Ou812
17/09 8:53
kissa it is as always a personal choice
kissa
17/09 8:53
Wolfbane1 that's an idea, respecting someone else's opinion, even if it isn't yours.
kissa
17/09 8:54
So, there's a silly saying in BDSM INMKBYKIOK
Brett
17/09 8:54
Male pet so true...learning about some one else in this lifestyle and life in general is a beautiful process
Pep
17/09 8:54
HellPrincess thank you!
Ou812
17/09 8:54
HellPrincess agrees , each are equals
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 8:54
HellPrincess yep. Agree
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 8:54
I think people have in large part lost the overall concept of respect for the lifestyle and the reasons behind it. Most are focused on getting respect, not earning it thru behavior
annabelladonna
17/09 8:54
Pep honestly i think this is very important. i think a lot of people forget language barriers exist even when people know the same language
Male pet
17/09 8:54
Brett it truly is a wonderful experience
Wolfbane1
17/09 8:54
kissa isnt that what BDSM is? An assortment of opinions and ideas that W/we share?
kissa
17/09 8:55
my cat just scratched me, damn it - someone tell me what those letters mean and why you think it's important to know
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:55
The best way as either a D or s is to actually GIVE respect
Pep
17/09 8:55
annabelladonna absolutely there's a lot of ways to misunderstand E/each O/other
kissa
17/09 8:55
INMKBYKIOK
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 8:55
Rev_Kinky exactly
HellPrincess
17/09 8:55
kissa it's not my kink but your kink is ok ?
kissa
17/09 8:56
HellPrincess yes!!!!
HellPrincess
17/09 8:56
Do I get points for this?
Pep
17/09 8:56
Your kink is not my kink but your kink is ok
Male pet
17/09 8:56
So many wonderful points raised by everyone, rooms like this are essential and I hope it flourishes
Pep
17/09 8:56
HellPrincess *hands you a lollipop*
HellPrincess
17/09 8:56
Male pet it's so needed right now.
colddark
17/09 8:56
Also submission is earned, not something taken for granted. Just because someone is a sub doesn't mean they have to submit to You.
kissa
17/09 8:56
Is that an expression of respect that we can all share? IS it an expression of kink? Why is it important/Is it important for others to know and stick with?
Brett
17/09 8:57
HellPrincess i always knew you were very knowledgeable. Congrats on that answer
Male pet
17/09 8:57
HellPrincess absolutely
Wicked Bitch
17/09 8:57
colddark exactly
kissa
17/09 8:57
Male pet please keep showing up! Friend me so you can keep an eye out for it
Draygorean
17/09 8:57
kissa active listening requires checking in with the other on a regular basis to find out if the journey you're on is consensual, mutual and respectful.. learning takes place when you can join up the dots easier each time.. the other person also feels that they have been listened to.. it is a two-way process..
BeautifulLoser_33
17/09 8:57
Hey all. I'd definitely tell my younger self to tone down the eagerness and be much more aware and observant. Missed out on a lot of opportunities for exploration and discovery
kissa
17/09 8:58
Draygorean that's wonderful. It sounds like it could really help establish some trust, too
parr2586
17/09 8:58
kissa I say don't yuck my yum lol. But basically we have to understand that what were into is not alway going to be what others are. And while we may not understand it, or even like it. It's there's. They have to live with the acceptance of it. Obviously there are some hard limits with kinks. But most are and should be up to the consenting individuals
kissa
17/09 8:58
BeautifulLoser_33 hi, welcome to the Garden. Whooo the frenzies and all that bundled eagerness are tough
HellPrincess
17/09 8:58
kissa I was kink shamed yesterday in the BDSM room without intervention from a mod. By anotjer dominant. I was flabbergasted. We must be able to recognize that of course we don't all like the same things, but nothing gives me the authority to make someone else feel bad or disgusto for what gives them pleasure. For the record, saying "eeeeeeeewwwwwww" is offensive af. Don't do that.
parr2586
17/09 8:59
And there is so much wrong grammatically there and I'm so so sorry lol
kissa
17/09 8:59
parr2586 Yes! That's another way to say it!
BeautifulLoser_33
17/09 8:59
Definitely get tunnel vision kissa
Wicked Bitch
17/09 8:59
Communication has to go both ways. I have found doms who don't think that They should share how they feel about what just happened
kissa
17/09 8:59
HellPrincess keyword: Kink Shaming - and, dude, that sucks hard. i'm sorry that happened to you
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 8:59
HellPrincess agreed
kissa
17/09 8:59
parr2586 we got it!
Rev_Kinky
17/09 8:59
Wicked Bitch absolutely! Communication is a two way street.
HellPrincess
17/09 9:00
LadyFlirtatious you and I have differences and we always communicate with respect. It's beautiful
Brett
17/09 9:00
So what should come first in gaining respect....active listening or actions
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:00
parr2586 this is not the place for grammar police. Grammar police are just arrogant and ......disrespectful ;)
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:00
HellPrincess i try dear
annabelladonna
17/09 9:00
Brett active listening then actions
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:00
Brett actions
kissa
17/09 9:00
ha!
parr2586
17/09 9:01
Brett I think it has to be a combination. It has to be hand in hand
Pep
17/09 9:01
Team listening vs. Team actions lol
Brett
17/09 9:01
And why did u answer the way you did
Agastya
17/09 9:01
kissa i believe in Destiny
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:01
Brett that's interesting...in my culture you don't gain respect, it's automatic until it's not. That is one thing that is culturall foreign to me here, "earning respect"
parr2586
17/09 9:01
LadyFlirtatious I'm the worst grammar police though! Lol. I gotta police myself too
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:01
Words mean nothing without actions
XCollieMan
17/09 9:01
Summers Kiss I felt that slap in my soul lol
kissa
17/09 9:01
Another word we seem to think is vital in BDSM is CONSENT. What would you tell your younger self about it? What would you tell a new person to BDSM about Consent?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:01
it's said a lot but it's not how i grew up thinking
HellPrincess
17/09 9:01
I think before you can listen and act, you must leave your ego aside. Otherwise, what's the point?
annabelladonna
17/09 9:01
Summers Kiss same in my culture respect is assumed with age
Ou812
17/09 9:01
Actions with consistency
HellPrincess
17/09 9:01
Summers Kiss same
parr2586
17/09 9:01
I think you have to show you're willing to listen while also showing your actions.
Pix
17/09 9:02
Also it's not mine but it's yours and that's ok is important because it's a way of showing we respect and trust our peers that they are consensually and safely engaging in their bdsm, for themselves and being true to themselves. It's that respect and compassion we've been talking about. If they ask us to engage we may say no but if they're not asking us to engage then it s their journey and exploration they're on. If we are worried a out something we see we can ask respectfully for information
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:02
Summers Kiss what is your culture if I may ask
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:02
HellPrincess annabelladonna agreed
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:02
Wicked Bitch Indigenous to the americas lol
Pix
17/09 9:02
Or research for ourselves. Not everyone wants or is free or available to educate at a given moment.
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:02
Ou812 yes actions with consistency show true intentions
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 9:02
Unfortunately i have to run.. RL ty all. Tc
Male pet
17/09 9:02
I was once removed from a room for not addressing the owner of the room as "Sir" I made it abundantly clear assertively and as respectfully as I could that I'm not comfortable addressing another man as Sir, needless to say we I never visited the room again, I wished him well and moved on without any fuss, he was trying to assert some type of dominance over me which was something I'll never allow to happen, I showed him respect in general as a person but that quickly disappeared due to his
Male pet
17/09 9:02
Conduct
Pep
17/09 9:03
Consent means nothing taking for granted, maybe a few basics like being polite but everything else needs to be agreed on.
parr2586
17/09 9:03
Summers Kiss it's one of the things I was raised with. Everyone is made inherently to deserve respect. Trust may have to be earned, but respect is inherent in the person who is created just like me.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:03
kissa that pressure can feel real, you have to be comfortable saying no and establishing your boundaries is what i would have told my younger self. that walk away is not disrespectful if you don't feel safe with a play partner
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:03
parr2586 ive seen people ridicule others in main for grammatical errors or typos. Its rude and disreapectful. Them lacking education doesnt make someone your punching bag, and you never know why. I have typos out the ass, but i also have a medical reason that my fingers dont work as well as others. You never know. Just...be nice
kissa
17/09 9:03
Male pet, what does that have to do with consent?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:03
parr2586 exactly how i was raised as well
HellPrincess
17/09 9:04
Male pet I find that behaviour laughable. A dominant is not MY Dominant. You did well
Male pet
17/09 9:04
kissa thank you kindly, I will do
Male pet
17/09 9:04
kissa my apologies I was still on respect and was behind on topics
parr2586
17/09 9:04
LadyFlirtatious *bows deeply* of course lady. I'm mostly playful with it. Your grammar isn't a reflection of your intelligence or you as a person. Mostly I just use humor as a way to pick into people armor and get closer lol
colddark
17/09 9:04
consent is something that can be revoked(donno if its the right word here) always/anytime and can be renegotiated....
Male pet
17/09 9:05
HellPrincess indeed it was laughable and bizarre behaviour
parr2586
17/09 9:05
colddark absolutely.
kissa
17/09 9:05
Male pet oh, no, it totally applies to concent *grins* you weren't consenting to it and he hadn't made it a protocol of the room
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:05
parr2586 i didnt mean that personally to you..but as a general rule. Kindness is respect. Being a good host is a show of respect
annabelladonna
17/09 9:05
colddark yess agree consent is a active thing that can be revoked at any moment
Ou812
17/09 9:05
colddark yes it can by anyone at anytime and should always be respected
parr2586
17/09 9:06
Summers Kiss it's why I call every lady ma'am lol. Unless they threaten to end me when it do
kissa
17/09 9:06
Another word we seem to think is vital in BDSM is CONSENT. What would you tell your younger self about it? What would you tell a new person to BDSM about Consent?
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:06
HellPrincess agreed. Being submissive doesn't automatically mean anyone can order you around as a dominant over you.
Male pet
17/09 9:06
kissa ah yes I hadn't actually thought about it like that! Thank you that makes perfect sense to apply it also to consent
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:06
parr2586 in my culture, we use kinship terms as a form of respect, so random elderly women are "grandma" or "kunsi"
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:06
parr2586 i get it haha
Pep
17/09 9:07
Summers Kiss interesting!
kissa
17/09 9:07
Male pet awesome!
XCollieMan
17/09 9:07
In my culture we call each other pendejos, cabrons and maricons outta straight love
XCollieMan
17/09 9:07
Lmao
kissa
17/09 9:07
Consent is part of every "how we do it" saying we have - SCC, PRICK, RACK - why?
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:07
To look deeply at consent. Every action or person you allow in your life ...you are consenting to by keeping them there. If someone doesnt treat your biundaries with respect. They are violating your consent. Walk away
Ou812
17/09 9:08
To empower others to know and understand they have voice yo consent to or not and that it is ok to say no
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:08
Ou812 yes
parr2586
17/09 9:08
Summers Kiss it's a lot like some of the Spanish cultures down here lol. An abuela is everyone's abuela lol
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:08
parr2586
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:08
Consent is so important. Having been in an abusive marriage there is a huge difference between being forced to versus making a choice. Consent is an agreed upon action prior to the action happening
Pep
17/09 9:08
The stereotypes of german BDSM are gas masks, uniforms and being rreeealllyy kinky and firm, it's hilarious. Lol.
HellPrincess
17/09 9:09
kissa do not disregard your limits. Do not let someone else dictate them for you. Do not compromise your hard limits to please someone else. If anyone wants to disregard your limits they are not in your best interest. Do not assume someone else's limits. Consent goes beyond touch, it also involves language, behaviours, topics of conversations. Consent changes day to day because our moods change as well. Ask for it.
Male pet
17/09 9:09
Consent is absolutely vital and one of the fundamental building blocks, it's something that can be fluid and personally with emotional cues, eye contact, verbal communication and actions...consent must be observed and respected wholeheartedly at all times, without it then I'm sure as we all know it's abuse
annabelladonna
17/09 9:09
LadyFlirtatious i struggle with cutting off people who overstep my boundaries. i give too many chances thinking they made honest mistakes.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:09
kissa it keeps us mentally, physically, and emotionally safe as possible with consent and the agency to consent. that part is critical.
Male pet
17/09 9:09
Again some wonderful points raised
Brett
17/09 9:09
How do you communicate consent.. does it happen in s moment or overtime
parr2586
17/09 9:10
Total agreement with HellPrincess on consent changing over time. It's fluid, so it has to be constantly checked on and worked with. Communication is key. Always keep checking
Ou812
17/09 9:10
Brett communication
kissa
17/09 9:10
Brett ooo big one!
kissa
17/09 9:10
Summers Kiss it does, yes.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:10
parr2586 HellPrincess agreed
HellPrincess
17/09 9:10
Brett I think it needs to be spoken as soon as we feel the need to. Oh Therese, we can't communicate the severity of the importance
Brett
17/09 9:10
kissa lol duh.
Pix
17/09 9:10
Wicked Bitch I agree there is consent before but it is also ongoing. Responses, feelings and desires can change and it is ok to revoke pre agreed consent by calling a halt. Safe words, traffic lights all allow this in a scene but can be used in interactions as well. I have emotionally safe worded to illustrate a topic is too overwhelming.
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:10
annabelladonna that doesnt make their abuse ok, yet a sub has to take responsibility for the things she consents to allowing to continue
kissa
17/09 9:10
So.. how do you get concent? How do you give it?
Pep
17/09 9:10
Trust and consent go hand in hand imho. It takes time to develop both.
kissa
17/09 9:11
And what kinds of things do we have to give consent for in BDSM-D/s?
Male pet
17/09 9:11
Brett it can be both I'd say, you can communicate it immediately and also as time goes on due to maybe someone exploring their limits with a Dom/me and then eventually saying no to a particular element of the lifestyle
annabelladonna
17/09 9:11
LadyFlirtatious very well put
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:11
Pix I agree it is fluid also
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:11
Consent is a constant give and take
parr2586
17/09 9:11
kissa I think you get consent by showing the other person that you have their best interest at heart. Showing them that you are a safe place. Then they can give you that consent freely knowing that you won't abuse it.
Ou812
17/09 9:11
LadyFlirtatious
kissa
17/09 9:12
LadyFlirtatious it is!
Pix
17/09 9:12
Wicked Bitch apologies I tagged you to start with the pror agreed point of yours to add and it is ongoing. I didn't mean to infer that you may not know or agree with the rest of my rambling. I apologies I should have separated them.
Male pet
17/09 9:12
parr2586 absolutely
kissa
17/09 9:12
Pix you're right!
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:12
Pix all good
HellPrincess
17/09 9:12
I think it's important that people understand- having someone say- NO- is immediate stop. Do not question it, do not undermine it. Apologize, say- I wasn't aware, and I will observe your limit better from here on. It's not something to be offended by.
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:12
I think for play, specifically, consent should be verbal, clear, and distinct
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:12
HellPrincess exactly
kissa
17/09 9:12
parr2586 right, so it's a build up thing or can you just ask, sometimes?
Wicked Bitch
17/09 9:12
HellPrincess so well put
Male pet
17/09 9:13
HellPrincess very true
Pix
17/09 9:13
Wicked Bitch thank you.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:13
kissa through vetting for me, i seek to understand how behaviors align with words, understanding boundaries/limits, and developing check-ins throughout every process. I will consent with understanding possible risks to certain play and emotional aspects and with clear understanding how those will be processed if i'm triggered and/or dropping or feel uncomfortable.
HellPrincess
17/09 9:13
In other words- don't get butthurt when you get called out.
kissa
17/09 9:13
HellPrincess that's pretty vital for all women. Do we ever have to ask for consent?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:13
i ask a lot of questions as well when seeking consent from another person.
annabelladonna
17/09 9:14
HellPrincess i'd like to add to that. i think this can be established differently in every relationship. sometimes i am afraid to speak up for myself and say no be it's not that i want a hard stop on the activity and make a big deal out of how i felt uncofrtsble. but rather a soft stop where we just refocus on connecting and resume with something else and continue the scene.
kissa
17/09 9:14
Summers Kiss how about RACK? Risk Aware Consensual Kink? Does that fit for you
Ou812
17/09 9:14
HellPrincess agrees , should be respected and also discussed with care of the other
Brett
17/09 9:14
LadyFlirtatious good point. Even in a D/s consent can be given or denied. How do you feel when one changes there mind and what actions would you make you take away one's consent
kissa
17/09 9:14
Wicked Bitch thanks for joining us! I hope to see you again soon
HellPrincess
17/09 9:14
kissa I ask my partner. May I sit on your lap? Can I call? Mind if we talk about xyz. And the thing about consent is, you always gotta be willing to hear a no.
kissa
17/09 9:14
What kinds of things do we need to ask for consent for?
parr2586
17/09 9:14
kissa a bit of both. Depending on what the consent is for. Some boundaries are learned through interaction over time, you like this, not this. But some things need to be very clear from the beginning, limits that you may have that trigger extreme responses.
kissa
17/09 9:15
HellPrincess that word is really tough to take sometimes
Draygorean
17/09 9:15
The most important aspect here is how much you value yourself. Allowing your emotional, physical, spiritual, mental and sexual health to be knowingly compromised amounts to self-abuse. If another does not accept your values and boundaries (but you must continually makes those clear as they may change with growth). It almost equates to ultimate care and respect..
kissa
17/09 9:15
parr2586 parr2586 do you have to consistently ask for them, even for the same things?
Male pet
17/09 9:15
Some Dom/mes have a warped sense of ego or pride or maybe they simply don't care enough about the submissive but it makes them a dangerous individual when they can't admit they maybe got something wrong or got carried away and react to what the submissive needs at that moment which is communication, reassurance, acknowledgment that from then on it'll never happen again, dynamics can live or die due to those types of situations
HellPrincess
17/09 9:15
annabelladonna oh yeah; that's where traffic lights are a great tool. Sometimes we just need to breathe. Generally speaking though, you should never feel like you can't say NO.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:16
kissa i think so because i think there are inherent risks to play so for me it makes sense to discuss that. I think also my background in research and counseling helps me understand consent from a different perspective, that it's going to be emotional but having a plan to manage those emotions is smart and compassionate.
kissa
17/09 9:16
Draygorean interesting thought, thank you. I hope everyone sees that
annabelladonna
17/09 9:16
HellPrincess agreed
Brett
17/09 9:16
HellPrincess is asking your partner this or that , us that asking for consent or respect
kissa
17/09 9:16
Male pet boy howdy, but can a submissive break consent?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:16
i've dropped a handful of times without any sort of plan on how to deal and i was fucking lucky i had oher subs to lean on. now i know ahead of time how to prepare for it the best i can
HellPrincess
17/09 9:16
Brett asking for consent IS respect
kissa
17/09 9:16
Summers Kiss that makes sense
Male pet
17/09 9:17
kissa a submissive should be able to take back consent yes absolutely
Brett
17/09 9:17
HellPrincess so very true
parr2586
17/09 9:17
kissa I think that's partly where the learning them comes into play. You may know somethings are always ok. But the gray areas always need to be asked about. And just learning your partner. Even an area that's normally safe may change, but they're afraid to say it. If you see hesitance you should absolutely ask. Bdsm shouldn't be just you getting what you want. It's supposed to be getting what W/we want together. And if I don't make a safe place for them too then I'm not holding my end
kissa
17/09 9:17
Many of you are talking about consent in sexual terms. Can it be for other things, too? Should it be? Like what?
kissa
17/09 9:18
Male pet i sure think so
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:18
kissa yes, for me emotional consent and certain discussions.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:18
cultural consent as well
Draygorean
17/09 9:18
If the other party believes in mutually, consensual gratifying behaviour.. it allows for a freeing up of one's barriers.. knowing that the goal is for higher levels of sensual gratification..
HellPrincess
17/09 9:18
Anytime, you should feel like you can back out. And you should feel comfortable in feeling that this other person will respect your choice. If you do not have that trust, you should not be playing together. Period.
Ou812
17/09 9:19
kissa to talk , to show pictures, to allow in ones life ,to call
annabelladonna
17/09 9:19
kissa consent in conversational terms is also very important i think. especially when it comes to emotionally dumping on others
kissa
17/09 9:19
parr2586 question to follow up, are you, sure that you're always able to see hesitation? What if it's unspoken/
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:19
"is it ok for us to talk about this, i know it's a hard topic" and having a way to manage the emotions from it is an example.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:19
Ou812 yes
kissa
17/09 9:19
Ou812 those are big, yes
kissa
17/09 9:20
annabelladonna whew, that is a tough one, yes
kissa
17/09 9:20
Summers Kiss nice!
Pix
17/09 9:20
I think HellPrincess put it really well rlearlier, can I sit in your,lap, can I call, can we talk about xyz. My emotions change on the spin of a wheel at times and I can't expect anyone to know it as I can barely keep up. Bit as I mentioned safe wording on an overwhelming conversation that wasn't at the beginning is just as important to me as being able to stop play.
Pep
17/09 9:20
Consent what defines U/us as people living a lifestyle W/we choose. Without consent it's absolutely not the same thing and might be even illegal, at least it's not pleasant.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:20
a consent of time used as well
HellPrincess
17/09 9:21
kissa it's important to empowers our submissives to say NO. Like parr2586 , encourage them to speak up, provide a feeling of safety. If they don't feel safe to refuse, you are failing big time
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:21
HellPrincess agreed
Male pet
17/09 9:21
HellPrincess Absolutely
parr2586
17/09 9:21
kissa you can't. You're absolutely right there. Which is why communication is key. I have to always be asking and checking, but in the other side, the submissive has to feel safe to speak up as well. No one can read minds and there is just as much weight on the submissive to speak her boundaries clearly as well. As HellPrincess was saying, be able to say no. But I have to make her feel like she is allowed to say no without fear of reprisals
kissa
17/09 9:22
So, something that Pep and i were talking about the other day that kind of hit me in the teeth was consenting to sexual advanaces or even flirting without intent to follow up... and having consent violations pointed out. How do you deal with that, even if a submissive is the one doing it?
Ou812
17/09 9:22
HellPrincess very much so
kissa
17/09 9:22
HellPrincess is also important to empower Dominants to say no to advances? Or should they just know already?
Ou812
17/09 9:22
kissa put boundaries in place
Pep
17/09 9:23
kissa W/we did?
kissa
17/09 9:23
parr2586 awesome
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:23
oof that's a tough one for me, i don't do well in grey areas and a lot of times, most play partners like grey areas of play.
kissa
17/09 9:23
Ou812 how?
annabelladonna
17/09 9:23
parr2586 this is very well put responsibility lies on both sides. i wish i could tell my younger self to not blame others for not being able to read my mind and tell i was uncomfortable bc "they should have known better."
kissa
17/09 9:23
Pep W/we did. It wasn't in that context, though
Pep
17/09 9:23
kissa lol I know
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:24
i try to shut down flirting with those i don't really know but i get called a tease a lot so sometimes i don't realize i'm flirting, but i try to make it clear in my bio what my expectations are, and others do not follow that with intention or hope of changing my mind. i struggle with that
kissa
17/09 9:24
annabelladonna that sounds like a MAJOR winner, for sure. An important lesson that is hard to learn, even as an adult
Ou812
17/09 9:24
kissa discussing what is acceptable what isn't under certain situations or circumstances
parr2586
17/09 9:25
annabelladonna it's not a fun topic for most of us lol. We have to let people know where we stand. That doesn't always excuse the terrible actions of others. But two things can be true at once. We can speak our minds clearer and also expect others to act better as well
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:25
rules make me feel safe i guess.
Draygorean
17/09 9:25
At the end of the day there is a choice to being a part of someone else's life, whether o/l or in r/l. So I agree with HellPrincess about the power of the word 'NO', which is a small word that delaying in saying can have traumatic repercussions..
kissa
17/09 9:25
So, Pep and i were also talking about things like honorifics and endearments, even the little ones like calling someone lovely in a greeting. Should those things need active consent?
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:25
I think it's always ok to respectfully tell someone "I'm not comfortable interacting this way" - from either/any side of the D/s slash. More explanation can be provided if wanted but it's certainly not required.
kissa
17/09 9:25
Ou812 yes, Sir, for sure
kissa
17/09 9:26
Summers Kiss me, too
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:26
ArabellaKneesocks agreed
kissa
17/09 9:26
Draygorean very true
parr2586
17/09 9:26
Summers Kiss I feel this so much lol. I'm always playful and joking with people. I try to be clear about what I'm actually available for. Which is absolutely nothing
kissa
17/09 9:26
ArabellaKneesocks i think so, yes, but sometimes that's hard, isn't it?
annabelladonna
17/09 9:27
yes honorifics and terms of endearment do need consent. it's like calling someone baby when you first meet them without asking. instant turn off and gives me goosebumps not in a good way
Pep
17/09 9:27
Actually iy happened within the rules kissa and I agreed on but it was weird nonetheless because W/we didn't think about that particular incident to happen when W/we B/both agreed to the rules.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:27
kissa in some ways i think you could, like with close women friends i greet them with terms of endearment, but at the same time, i've had others call me terms of endearment like "doll" "lil one" etc and it is uncomfortable for me. whether that warrants consent, i'm not sure but i definitely tell them to please stop.
parr2586
17/09 9:27
kissa It's like me saying ma'am. It's a hard habit to break being from the south. I call people younger than me it all the time lol. But I do always try and respect when people ask me not to
Ou812
17/09 9:27
ArabellaKneesocks agrees and each should be able to voice that without negative recourse
BBC provider
17/09 9:27
Yeah I can really relate. To that I always keep constant communication about consent and what not
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:27
kissa I think the most important thing when it comes to the details of what qualifies as an honorific and what requires active consent, is how we react when questioned on it perhaps? In the example where someone refers to me as "lovely" it is reasonable to expect that's ok, but if I asked them not to I would expect it to be respected. And certainly it can be hard to speak up, especially if it's *not* a stranger.
Pix
17/09 9:27
ArabellaKneesocks I think so too and if something comes up I didn't expect in casual passing I can put it in my profile to give people a heads up if it's one that comes up casually and often.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:28
ArabellaKneesocks agreed
Pep
17/09 9:28
Honorifics and endearments will be another topic coming up soon.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:28
parr2586 same, but i also try to shut it down from the start because i can sense it, then i get called guarded lol.
kissa
17/09 9:28
parr2586 that seems fair. That is a cultural habit that i accepted where you live but it might make other people feel obligated to behave in a specific way toward you
kissa
17/09 9:29
ArabellaKneesocks how can we do that, when it's a comfortable or semi-comfortable person?
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:29
Pix that's an excellent tool for setting those boundaries and expectations/reminders.
Male pet
17/09 9:29
Thank you all for your kind and informative comments, unfortunately I must run. Take care
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:29
for so long, even Sir was uncomfortable for me due to racial history i associated with that word and older white males demanding it from me (again cultural closeness we use kinship terms) so that is something i had to explore in 2020 when i joined the room.
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:30
kissa How can we do what, call out something that's making us uncomfy?
kissa
17/09 9:30
ArabellaKneesocks yes
Pix
17/09 9:30
ArabellaKneesocks it makes it easier for me to say to someone when it comes up then because even if they haven't read my profile I can direct them to it and it 'proves' it's not them personally it is a rule I keep for me.
parr2586
17/09 9:30
kissa I think some of it too is the way you interact with people. I try and make sure that people know that I'm easy going and not using the word as an "honorific" that carries a lot of weight to it. It's not always perfect I know
annabelladonna
17/09 9:30
Summers Kiss i felt this so well put
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:30
I simply and tactfully explain that i only allow those things from my Sir. If that is not respected, i distance or block
Pep
17/09 9:31
I remember a Dom calling a sub a "good girl" out of nowhere recently. she asked him not to do that but he wouldn't have it at first. It needed a few people to explain the problem with that kind of attention towards a submissive he didn't know really.
kissa
17/09 9:31
LadyFlirtatious that's totally valid
HellPrincess
17/09 9:31
My applgoies, kissa - JW Missionaries arrives at my door. Nice people. Consent goes both ways. My partner and I are both switches, but we try to check in as often as possible. We also have spent enough tome together to pick up on unspoken cues. I will sit by his feet, wait a while- it's a soft consent because sometimes in excitement I also jump on him. It's not something I'm gonna get in trouble for, but it's something I like to try to be mindful of. It's not just the action- it's about the time
Ou812
17/09 9:31
parr2586 being from south myself calling stranger or being called dear , honey , sweetie is just accepted with a smile with no ill intent
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:32
kissa if it's something very simple or something I don't care to interact with in private for boundary reasons, then in a public and concise way just "please don't do x with me specifically" or "can you call me Arabella instead of little bitch please?" etc. If it's someone I know, or something with nuance, I'm happy to have a private brief chat about why something bugs me. But I do reserve the right to shut it down if someone is violating my boundaries during a conversation about boundaries
HellPrincess
17/09 9:32
Pep huge pet peeve of mine. If I'm not yours, do NOT call me a good girl. Instantly makes me nauseous
kissa
17/09 9:32
Ou812 Sir, but to take that behavior or language out of the south, Southern Men are sometimes seen as "creepy" for it. How can we negotiate that?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:32
ArabellaKneesocks yes <3
Pep
17/09 9:32
HellPrincess she was very clear about it immediately
parr2586
17/09 9:32
ArabellaKneesocks well said
HellPrincess
17/09 9:33
LadyFlirtatious this^
kissa
17/09 9:33
ArabellaKneesocks that's great!
Ou812
17/09 9:33
As it should for all us , personally i never want someone uncomfortable if i cause that a few simple words will get apology which an assurance it will never happen again
parr2586
17/09 9:33
kissa for me, I've learned to try and not even use that word until I've gotten to know them better. Once they know me for the person I am. I may say it. Then they normally feel more comfortable telling me not to
kissa
17/09 9:34
So, besides the things we talked about, trust, communication, respect, and consent, what else should people new to the BDSM lifestyle learn about real fast?
HellPrincess
17/09 9:34
We are responsible for stating our boundaries. When we let things slide to be polite or non confrontational, we are setting ourselves up for further miscommunication. Do nottt do thissss
Ou812
17/09 9:34
kissa lol females do it here also i understand and guard my words
Pep
17/09 9:34
Ou812 *nods* good way to see it
kissa
17/09 9:34
parr2586 that's fair
SubtleTemptation
17/09 9:34
HellPrincess For me, considering the use of the word "Sir" it confuses me when in the first chat someone addresses me as such. I thought/ think it's showing resurrect but we've only just met. Do I deserve it? Needs to be earnt surely? Don't get me wrong, I don't follow lifestyles/ labels etc as they are so fluid and different so I'm not an expert here! But, chipping into the discussion
kissa
17/09 9:34
Ou812 Sir, THAT is a point that i'm really glad you made. What should women know about that/
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:34
BDSM people are still just people and you won't always be compatible as people just because you have identical kinks
HellPrincess
17/09 9:35
SubtleTemptation I only use Sir with my own or towards someone I hold in high regard.
Pep
17/09 9:35
ArabellaKneesocks absolutely
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:35
kissa red flag behaviors honestly.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:35
ArabellaKneesocks agreed
annabelladonna
17/09 9:35
i think patience is another word that's important. learning times time. being together takes time. i get hormones and being horny kind of demands a instant gratification but it's important to be patient with people and urself when entering the community
HellPrincess
17/09 9:35
Summers Kiss I second this
kissa
17/09 9:35
Summers Kiss we will have a whole chat about red flags soon, but what about them?
SubtleTemptation
17/09 9:35
HellPrincess This is what I always go with. Early on "What do you seek, want, need" along with clarity about definitions. I don't say I'm a Dom, but when I've chatted I've been told I've got tendencies. That's fine, but that's just me being me. Not me being a Dom.
kissa
17/09 9:36
ArabellaKneesocks an important lesson hard learned by a few of us
HellPrincess
17/09 9:36
kissa pay attention. Do not ignore them.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:36
allowing yourself grace to grow and change, not feeling to conform to a label, understanding labels serve a purpose to understand but not necessarily something that has to be black and white, but a spectrum
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:36
Mentorship doesn't require penetration - not as serious as this chat is but sort of a theme of things to know when you're new!
annabelladonna
17/09 9:36
this has been such a wonderful conversation i have a call and incase i'm not done in time to say bye i just wanted to say thank you to everyone for having it
kissa
17/09 9:36
annabelladonna oof, yes, it is. Patience is SO hard to come by in the middle of the Frenzies. How do we cultivate it?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:37
kissa understand how to recognize red flags and what seeing those mean for you to do or how to react. observing behaviors not that you receive, but also see in others. it's really important to recognize consistency
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:37
ArabellaKneesocks yessss
HellPrincess
17/09 9:37
annabelladonna this. TAKE YOUR TIME. Others can say what they want. In my opinion... you see pekple numpimg into dynamics after a week of knowing each other and it's like .... *sigh* I get you are excited, but where did reason go?
kissa
17/09 9:37
HellPrincess what are they?
kissa
17/09 9:37
Summers Kiss that's hard sometimes, yes?
kissa
17/09 9:38
annabelladonna please return to us next saturday at 11 ET
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:38
a lot of males would say to me "you're a submissive" and would laugh at me for even suggesting that i could be a Domme, while i wasn't a Domme, i didn't like how i felt cornered by these men i initially met
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:38
i wasn't allowed space to explore
parr2586
17/09 9:38
Be slow and patient. Take your time. Period. You're literally taking another persons mental and physical health into your hands and giving them yours in return. It's precious and should be handled as such
Ou812
17/09 9:38
ArabellaKneesocks mentoring isn't training , think that lesson should be taunt....training involves play , mentoring doesn't...in my opinion
HellPrincess
17/09 9:38
kissa some clear ones? Demanding anything. Having your feelings dismissed.
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:38
Summers Kiss that is a big one for me. I don't like people who are more interested in correctly guessing who I am than just learning.
kissa
17/09 9:39
HellPrincess thank you!
Pep
17/09 9:39
Be honest with yourself. There's a misunderstanding sometimes that a Dominant kmows every way in the lifestyle or at least has a way for the sub to grow etc. It's important to admit to yourself that sometimes you don't have a damn clue about yourself. Maybe the next day will be different when you had time to think about it.
parr2586
17/09 9:39
Summers Kiss I'm still waiting to see your Domme side lol. It's in there somewhere. Along with your sadist side
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:39
kissa it can be, but i think knowing what those red flags are and how they can express in behavior can help recognize, but also, really having the ability to remove our own emotions from that person time to time to reflect
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:39
parr2586 ty ty
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:39
ArabellaKneesocks <3 agreed
kissa
17/09 9:39
Pep that's important for subs and slaves, too, i think
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:40
Ou812 perhaps so, but I think if using play to train, it has to be SO clear what the intentions are, what the desired results are and are not.
Pep
17/09 9:40
kissa I can only speak for Myself in that case
Ou812
17/09 9:41
ArabellaKneesocks agrees very much so , what is to be accomplished and how to achieve it with consent from both
Pep
17/09 9:41
Ooh the cavalry..!
HellPrincess
17/09 9:41
Summers Kiss anyone who corners you can get a bye bye bye. I've had male dominants who try to ridicule me, oppress me, force me into submission, or negate my identity. It's a matter of ego for them. Eventually you learn to spot it and say- you are rude and I don't like you. *ignore*
parr2586
17/09 9:41
Pep you're definitely right lol. I'm still learning about where I stand with my sides. It's fun to learn if you're not scared of it. But it takes alot if honesty as well
kissa
17/09 9:41
Pep it's true, though. i think that a lot of times, we want to appear more well versed in what we know than we really are and that gets people in trouble
Pep
17/09 9:41
parr2586 absolutely
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:41
HellPrincess 100%
Ou812
17/09 9:41
Pep lol ikr we don't have all the answers .... we are discovering ourself also along the way ...we make mistakes
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:42
HellPrincess and it's really important for new learners not to feel their are less of a Dom/me or sub for being on a spectrum
HellPrincess
17/09 9:42
We equate knowledge with personal value. Nah. Be humble, be open, have fun learning. Mistakes are useful and necessary
Pep
17/09 9:42
Ou812 yes but sometimes it seems we are not supposed to or allowed
kissa
17/09 9:43
Pep is that a Manly Men thing?
HellPrincess
17/09 9:43
Summers Kiss I'm a switch and I kick asss. We gotta teach submissives they can have dominant tendencies. It's ok to explore
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:43
i've lowkey heard male Dominants dissing on other Doms for not being as "hard" as them, again this was when i first joined
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:43
A person who has their shit together 100% of the time is just a person I haven't been allowed to know well. That also applies to Dominants.
Rev_Kinky
17/09 9:44
Exploration is definitely a cornerstone of my personal BDSM lifestyle
Pep
17/09 9:44
Summers Kiss that's a red flag for me surely
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 9:44
To be honest.. tje discussions we having now.. is the exact reason why i rarely engage in PM with woman. Dor some it is, they want to get in, get what they want and get out. Others want to talk, get to know the other person and see where it
Pep
17/09 9:44
kissa it's an experience, ask Ou12
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:44
Summers Kiss Are you sure you didn't overhear a performance enhancing drug commercial?
Pep
17/09 9:44
Ou812 ^
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:45
ArabellaKneesocks perhaps it was
kissa
17/09 9:45
How about the possibility that the "experienced people" might be, gods forbid, wrong so to trust but verify when learning about BDSM?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:45
HellPrincess agreed
kissa
17/09 9:45
Pep is it?
parr2586
17/09 9:46
Summers Kiss I'm as soft as it gets as a Dom they were definitely talking about me
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:46
I think its important to know what is right for others isnt right for you, and that is fine
kissa
17/09 9:46
What else would you tell a person new to BDSM?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:46
kissa yes. i think that's important lesson, that asking questions should be welcomed. A good Dominant friend initially encouraged me to explore other perspectives and other submissive experiences since they didn't have all the answers and only could speak to their experience and it honestly was so important to my growth
Pix
17/09 9:46
I think one of the things I'd want to tell myself is that even when I gain a better understanding of elements of this it's still only a better understanding than yesterday so not to be afraid of where I stand cos there isn't a finish line where one can say I know all there is now and so no matter where you are it's valid.
Pep
17/09 9:47
Don't listen to everyone
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:47
The experienced people can be very wrong and use their experience for clout to hurt people. That happens with any "community" though. But the other and more innocent and common side is just that they can't be experts at what is right for you specifically.
kissa
17/09 9:47
Or, more importantly, what would you tell a young relative or friend if they were curious about BDSM?
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:47
parr2586 i don't even know if you were here then
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:47
ArabellaKneesocks yesss
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:47
Doms and subs..when done right....know each other and the biundaries and expectations. I cant say anothers boundaries or expectations are wrong unless i know bith people and know the terms that were agreed on
HellPrincess
17/09 9:47
Something that happens to Dominants a lot- we get bombarded with "will you be my mistress?" "Will you teach me xyz?" It's like.... dude. What? No. Stop. Stop. It makes me defensive and I try to remain polite-
kissa
17/09 9:48
HellPrincess where do you send them?
colddark
17/09 9:48
there is no such thing as one size fits all...
Pep
17/09 9:48
HellPrincess that's a Domme's specific experience right?
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:48
ArabellaKneesocks exactly
Ou812
17/09 9:48
Observe, learn , discuss before engaging, we have two eyes and ears for a reason
HellPrincess
17/09 9:48
kissa I have nowhere to send them to other than main chat.
HellPrincess
17/09 9:49
Pep I assume it happens to males too?
kissa
17/09 9:49
Ou812 and one mouth - you're right
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:49
kissa there is no shame in being a sexual being and that submission isn't less than. i think a lot of people that i know in real life see it as silly and/or just a sexual kink
Pep
17/09 9:49
HellPrincess not really at least not very often. There's a lot of "malesubs" out there.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:49
develop a critical lens of what media/porn is presenting to you
kissa
17/09 9:50
Summers Kiss valid
HellPrincess
17/09 9:50
Summers Kiss and that we can be both, submissive and feminists
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:50
HellPrincess YES
kissa
17/09 9:50
HellPrincess maybe we need a link list to give people
Pix
17/09 9:50
And also, those practices of communication and honesty and trust and respect in yourself first can be terrifyingly vulnerable and even when you know their value in theory they only benefit you and your partners when you put them into practice. Ie. Practice, practice, practice. Because vulnerability, fear, past experiences can make it really hard to do those things consistently and the best way to have them to hand when you're struggling is practice. I still struggle with this even knowing how
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:50
i also think there is an inherent undervaluing and male patriarchal attitude that looks at male submissives as less than especially
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:50
it's inherently there in the room
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:51
those attitudes i mean
ArabellaKneesocks
17/09 9:51
Pix oh I need to read that again and again. It's not a one time thing. It's consistent practice.
Pix
17/09 9:51
Important it is and sharing it as info people should know when I still struggle with it. But it is a practice a mindful, decided practice.
HellPrincess
17/09 9:51
Summers Kiss I have seen a lot of ill treatment beeeeen "alphas" and submissive males. You are right
kissa
17/09 9:51
Pix so... how?
kissa
17/09 9:51
Summers Kiss you're right.
kissa
17/09 9:51
RAZIEL679 there are a few of us that are quite old school, too
Pep
17/09 9:52
Summers Kiss maybe you're right. I also think there's a lot of "wanters and needers" among the malesubs which mskes it difficult to see the ones who tske it more seriously
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:52
and the female Dommes are subjected from the male gaze as having to be macho and cruel.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:52
Though i find that is being challenged more
RAZIEL679
17/09 9:52
kissa like the original was gaining pleasure out of causing anothers pain and suffering
Pix
17/09 9:52
kissa mindfulness, taking a breath to think on what I'm feeling before I offer the autopilot shut down answer of I don't know.
HellPrincess
17/09 9:52
Summers Kiss I'm cruel because I wanna be
Witty Wordsmith
17/09 9:52
Summers Kiss it's inherentially there in general I don't think it's just limited to dominant males. It's pervasive.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:52
so again, just not feeling trapped by labels
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:53
Witty Wordsmith yes
Auth0riz3d1
17/09 9:53
HellPrincess lol
kissa
17/09 9:53
Summers Kiss but also expected to be the "do-er" but also giving in and puttng out
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:53
HellPrincess
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:53
kissa yessss
HellPrincess
17/09 9:53
Witty Wordsmith Hello, Sir.
kissa
17/09 9:53
RAZIEL679 *smiles* perhaps you'd like to join more of our discussions because we're way beyond those stereotypes.
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:54
so perhaps an intersection of patriarchy, feminism and BDSM is something to consider in how it affects our experiences of the lifestyle is ok to explore.
Witty Wordsmith
17/09 9:54
I have seen so many submissive females act harshly towards submissive males. And I'm sure it goes both ways with dom males acting that way towards dom females.
Witty Wordsmith
17/09 9:54
HellPrincess Hello princess
kissa
17/09 9:54
Witty Wordsmith welcome!
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:54
Witty Wordsmith great point
Pix
17/09 9:54
Thinking about what I want to say the impulsive easy pleasing answer and trying to remember how it might feel easier in the moment but is actually likely to be a disservice to me and the person I'm communicating with. Reminding myself that if in a dynamic it's actually going against an agreement to not answer openly.
kissa
17/09 9:54
Witty Wordsmith that's a good point and one i am guilty of
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:54
Witty Wordsmith it's an interesting hierarchy
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:55
Pep maybe but i also think the space has been hostile towards male subs, even those who aren't wanters/needers and i wonder if there is a way to make that space more welcoming
HellPrincess
17/09 9:55
Witty Wordsmith *nods* Excellent point . As of being submissive makes a male less of a man
Pix
17/09 9:56
I do not always succeed in this, I'm human and I fail and when I do, trying to own you with my mistakes, address the reasons I may not have done so in the moment and hear how it affected the other party. And that can be hard too. So again practice, practice practice?
kissa
17/09 9:56
Pix always
Pep
17/09 9:57
Summers Kiss interesting thought. I never really thought about it so far. And I have a deep rooted submissive past, I know probably what they are going through and have to endure to find a Dom/me who suits to them
HellPrincess
17/09 9:57
Pix always. Strive to be a better human. Acknowledge our mistakes and learn. And talk- don't be afraid to apologize or be wrong. When in doubt, ask
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:58
Pep it's something i observe, but do not have the experience of, so i'm mindful to try not to speak for
Pix
17/09 9:58
HellPrincess *nods*
Pix
17/09 9:58
Sorry, I got lost in thought and the room has moved so far on. I'm sorry for punctuating off topic.
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:58
Summers Kiss i treat them with respect until they push boundaries. There are a handful of malr subs who treat the lifestyle with any kind of respect on here
Pep
17/09 9:58
Summers Kiss it's a long journey so much is clear
HellPrincess
17/09 9:59
LadyFlirtatious *nods*
kissa
17/09 9:59
Ladies and Gentlemen, we've been going for two hours. Thank you all so very much for today's chat. We will be rotating days and events to see how they best settle into the week for the most folks to join us. If you're interested, feel free to Friend me and keep an eye on my wall. I will also be periodically mentioning things in the BDSM room.
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 9:59
Pix your thoughts are always valued dear
kissa
17/09 9:59
Pix your thoughts are important and valued
Summers Kiss
17/09 9:59
LadyFlirtatious absolutely there are levels of folks pushing boundaries. i think there probably a balance to be found somewhere along the way
LadyFlirtatious
17/09 10:00
Summers Kiss i think its an individual thing. We each should be kind, until kindness is used against us
kissa
17/09 10:01
You're welcome! I will be working on a small guide that we can point people to that has your thoughts as points to research and ask about for new folks.
HellPrincess
17/09 10:01
Community
HellPrincess
17/09 10:04
Pix I think I'm grateful for everyone who came out today. It shows that there is an interest in nurturing our lifestyle. It takes effort and time. We all play a part
Pep
17/09 10:04
Thanks E/everyone for sharing your thoughts and/or joining